I don't feel as strongly about quote posts as I did in 2018. Personally, I am not a fan, but there is clearly a lot of demand for it. We're considering it.
Demand doesn't necessarily mean something is a good idea though?
There's a lot of demand for centralisation, but that would be a really bad idea.
@Eetschrijver @feditips @Gargron same. Demand comes also from what people were used to. That doesn't mean it is necessarely an improvement. There's a reason people are leaving the birdsite
@feditips @Gargron precisely… if they’re fresh from the battleground and it’s all peaceful here in comparison… why is complaining about a quote post the first thing they try? I could not find one thing to demand or complain about at all when I arrived in Nov last year. “Sure is peaceful here, let’s screw it up, PRETTY PLEASE” is not really okay with a lot of us…
In this case, you'd promote it as a good idea, rather than saying you can't help but implement it because it was "in demand".
@katzenberger @Gargron I mean, there's a demand because a lot of people think is a good idea.
@vitordelucca @feditips @Gargron That doesn't apply in this case. The idea is a very, very bad one.
@queercrip @vitordelucca @feditips @Gargron It's been discussed to death elsewhere, but here's some starting points. https://nationalpost.com/life/the-important-questions-why-the-quote-tweet-is-the-absolute-worst-twitter-function https://www.theringer.com/tech/2018/5/2/17311616/twitter-retweet-quote-endorsement-function-trolls
We aren't just individuals, we are all part of a community.
If the community turns toxic, we all suffer.
Features which encourage toxicity harm all of us, because they affect how people around us behave. Toxicity promotes aggression, suspicion and stress, it makes the world a nastier place to live in.
@feditips
@Gargron Honestly, I don't really see how it was used in such a toxic matter. I'm not saying it wasn't, just not my experience. That might also explain why I don't have such a hard stance against it. Then again, I didn't truly experience how toxic Twitter could be for myself up until recently. I never really posted or replied there tho, that might be why too. I just mainly watched some gaming news accounts and YouTubers and such. I never got into politics much there.
@deurman @feditips @Gargron There can be no doubt that if the goal is conversations, the ability to quote RT derailed what little remained of meaningful discourse on Twitter. The introduction of quote RTs opened the floodgates to controversy-led hot takes. The negative effects far outweigh the positives IMO.
As a side note, as with all software development, making what people ask for might not be the right move. What lies behind the requests for quote RTs on Mastodon?
@deurman @feditips @Gargron Also, quote RTs were (and are) used to create pile-ons and drive toxicity on Twitter. Just because you haven’t personally experienced it doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen. Ask basically any woman, person of color or member of a marginalized community what happens when they voice their opinions on Twitter and the hateful far-right/Redditsphere picks it up. It’s not pretty.
@gloom303
@feditips @Gargron True, that's why I also said that. I said that I didn't try to say that it wasn't the case, just that I, before this whole quote tweet in mastodon argument was a thing, wasn't aware that it was such a controversial feature. Doesn't mean that it isn't the case. Just that I wasn't personally aware of it until recently. If that was the idea my earlier reply gave off, I'm sorry. That wasn't my intention. Just an explanation for my personal opinion on it.
@deurman @feditips @Gargron There’s a fair bit of research on what made Twitter toxic:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/365209749_User_Engagement_and_the_Toxicity_of_Tweets
https://hatelab.net/publications/
And here are two editorial takes I agree with: https://www.theringer.com/platform/amp/tech/2018/5/2/17311616/twitter-retweet-quote-endorsement-function-trolls
https://onezero.medium.com/quote-tweets-have-turned-us-all-into-jerks-d5776c807942
@deurman @feditips @Gargron a lot of accounts got big not by doing anything special but simply quote tweeting good content from others. That was a real problem there and will be here too. We will all need to opt out if/when it becomes a reality to keep engagement on our content with us, not some low effort quoter
@feditips @Gargron I suspect QTs are worst when someone with a lot of followers/reach is “punching down” on someone without that audience … especially when an algorithm is likely to promote it even more. But either way, there’s no way to auto-ban “negative” QTs.
I wonder if the community could organically enforce a standard of etiquette with them? Like with spoilers? If an algorithm isn’t massively juicing the reach, seems like it could be called out & shamed into less of a problem?
@feditips @Gargron Odd analogy. Decentralization is the main structural aspect of the Fediverse and Mastodon, quote boosting is just a possible feature. And if the latter is abused by bad actors, moderation will be much better than on the other site; if a whole instance is a problem, defederation takes care of it - something impossible on Twitter. Not at all different from like now when users write abusive posts. QB won't make things worse and are good for context.
@feditips
There is a lot of demand for feature parity between the web interface and the mobile clients, and doing so would also be a really good idea.
Sometimes things that are in demand *are* good things. Bringing up centralization serves no purpose in this discussion—it’s pure rhetoric.