@stux those are the people who said at the beginning that "vulnerable people should just stay home"... how do they not understand that they are the vulnerable group now?

@JennyFluff Indeed.. I feel so ashamed for my country by this..

@JennyFluff Oh yes! But lately I have the feeling the NL leads the path in this anti behaviour :sad_cat: The gab is getting bigger and bigger here

@JennyFluff @stux I think that's what's missing in Poland - we've got actual walk-in vaccination points and people don't use these. We've got so many vaccines and so little amount of people actually want to get it. I'm afraid that such restrictions are the only way.

@netsatan @JennyFluff Same here.. Th chances are here, and plenty for free but still there's soo many resistance 🤔

Even my mother in law.. She works in in the care with elderly people but refuses to take the vaccine :mortyderp:​ We often have many discussions about it but in the end it's her decision. Maybe rules can make her rethink it or just take a different job without the risk of infecting elderly ppl

covid, death 

@netsatan @stux After I met a (otherwise really nice) antivaxxer that wouldn't vaccinate her toddler, I really think that the common vaccinations need to be mandatory (for everyone who has no medical reason not to be). Same for covid, we're not gonna get rid of that now and this is the only way to not have many many more people get badly sick and die directly or indirectly (because no hospital capacity etc).

covid, death 

@JennyFluff @stux common vaccinations are mandatory here in Poland and still there's a group of people resisting to vaccinate their children with whatever they can. COVID vacc is not obligatory here unfortunately.

@netsatan @JennyFluff @stux literally the same thing here in the states. I'm getting my booster tomorrow!

The same people here who scream about the government being evil are the ones electing the do-nothings and bad-faith actors into power. Some sort of insane self-fulfilling prophecy or something so they can feel self-righteous in screaming "see, I told you!" as they've burned it all down.

@JennyFluff @stux At this point, vaccine mandates are just about control.

We don't live in monarchies or dictatorships. People have a right to make their own choices about medical procedures. Let them make their choices and deal with the consequences.

COVID-19 isn't going anywhere. The sooner we stop pretending it is, the sooner governments have to stop abusing their authority.

This is just the new PATRIOT act. Soon, they'll want to track everyone's movements 24/7. For safety.

@Bradley_JF @JennyFluff We live in Europe and don't have such a thing... :mortyderp:

Like said, the government isn't some monster or alien.. It's people chosen by us.. Why is this an issue? It's also the law you need to wear cloths in public right? Or is that also a first step to TOTAL control about every single aspect of your life..?

Sorry but I really don't get this way of thinking. What do the vaccine and tracking people have to do with one and another? There's microchips in the vaccine? Sats can track vacinated people? What?

@stux @JennyFluff the issue at stake is bodily autonomy. The State shouldn't be able to force you to undergo a medical procedure that you don't want.

Even if nothing else is in your control, you at least should have rights to your own flesh and blood. That's not the same as putting on pants before going outside.

And the tracking is in the Vaccine Pass apps that are mentioned in the article that you shared. I see this as a first step towards governments normalizing this level of surveillance.

@stux @JennyFluff And with this precedent, what's next? It's ok to jail people who don't get an annual flu shot? The State gets to say who is allowed to have children? That sounds absurd, but in the US, we fought that fight already.

The only business the government should have in healthcare is in providing access, not in demanding compliance.

@Bradley_JF @stux @JennyFluff Indeed the vaccine passes are concerning, in France they’re (insecure) QR codes that you can get printed at a pharmacy, but mandatory vaccination is a thing in France and I’ve never felt controlled by it.

The actual dystopian surveillance enablers are the people who refuse to get vaccinated because they live in a delusion where they could sit at a table and argue about pandemics with a virologist.

@nekobit @JennyFluff

Some people see governments as some sort of enity or monster or something but in the end they are just people like us that WE chose to represent us in a somewhat smaller number.. (mostly!) The government isn't a monster.. It's just a symbol lol!

@stux if people see their freedom going to be demolished, that's sadly the logical result 😔

@netsatan I don't mind the restrictions, to be honest I thought the issue was fighting the virus but it appears it's more about someone's opinion than the actual virus.. I don't get it..

@stux i still don't get it, why people don't want to get the shot

@netsatan @stux
It's not about the shot!
It's about oppression, freedom of choice and diversion. Shots arent gonna solve this issue, find something else. You can never have a 100% vaccination of the population. Even if you manage to reach that in EU, what about the rest of the world ? Then what, closed borders ? We need another solution, and better be open-source this time.

I agree.
There will be more vax shots. The Spanish flu after WWI lasted about 2 1/4 years with no vaccine. Hopefully Covid will run it's course.
@netsatan @stux

@netsatan @stux
Yall never gunna know cuz it seems you keep blocking the people that are warning you about it and than calling them crazy conspiracy theorist.

if you ever do wanna know; just follow the money and use logic to identify the rest. ;)

@original_fractalator @stux thinking for yourself is definitely a good thing, but if you accuse someone of something, have a proof to back it up.

@netsatan @stux

Hmm, there is plenty of resources that could be provided that map all this out but dunno if that would be convincing at all; somethings are better understood thru experience.

If your open to it tho;
Is there even a little part of all this that leaves you skeptical?

How much freedom can you tolerate them trying to take from you before it feels like jail?

If the goverment was trying to be tyranical, what would they be doing differently?

@original_fractalator @stux there are so many countries and governments that it really is difficult for me to reply to what you're saying. You keep repeating that part about being open and I'd love to do that, but for now there's nothing to be open to, except two meme-like images you've posted.

@netsatan @stux

majority of the goverments around the world are puppeted by giant corporations;
and giant corporations are puppeted by giant banks;
all the money can be followed to the "Bank of International Settlements" which regulates over 95% of the worlds currency.

The banks fund the corps; and the corps fund the govt laws, the laws are than used to control people to sustain their power.

Goverments follow international banking law, not societies will.

@original_fractalator @stux hm, thanks. I think that what I got here is some ideas but without anything to back it up or any concrete link/proof. What is that majority of governments (which? how?), how do you know all that?

@netsatan @stux

You can use this wiki article about the bank of international settlements as as a starting point; click the 'members' tab to see all the countries involved with them.


@original_fractalator @stux that's not a proof of any malicious act. You could say that UN is created for global military hegemony over the world if you take a look at the members list.

@netsatan @stux

Sure, but this should at least bring awareness that the general population has very lil control over the decisions that goes on in the political world, and how such decisions made by the BIS can effect everyone worldwide;
when you break down that barrier, the rest can begin to make sense.

As far as them bieng evil... again just ask yourself, if they wanted tyranical control over the planet, what would they be doing differently than they are now?

If you don't mind the restrictions or taking the vax that's your choice. Many of us don't like it. It's got nothing to do with peoples opinions.
@stux "Evil" was discovered by hard working people with a methodology. Real conspiracies were uncovered and not by random people saying "hey this logically could happen or be the case", but people trained in finding the truth. Science is slow and boring, and while COVID could be a conspiracy, its a crappy way to do it and just hurt one's own nation. Also it means that literally EVERY SINGLE SCIENTIST is covering it all up, and you can't keep that level of secrecy. We are skepical of a lot of things though one of the rich things about conspiracy theories is they distract from actual conspiracies going on and conspiracy theorists blunt the impact of people trying to raise the alarm bells about real conspiracies with real evidence. Was the virus made in a wuhan lab? I don't know and neither do you. more research needed, just like everything in science.
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